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User Scripts & Dragons - KDE 4.7.2 coming soon to sid

detaos - 01.12.2011, 02:08
Post subject: KDE 4.7.2 coming soon to sid
Everybody get ready to hold on to your hat ... KDE 4.7.2 is coming soon to sid.

http://lists.debian.org/debian-qt-kde/2 ... 00000.html

I've been running it for a few days now from qt-kde.debian.net, and found it to be just as speedy and stable as any other good release, so hopefully this will go smoothly for everyone.
zbreaker - 01.12.2011, 02:15
Post subject:
Of course I will keep to the rear of the crowd,check the forums and proceed with caution.
DeepDayze - 01.12.2011, 13:14
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Any breakages or major issues identified from your testing that you can make us aware of, detaos?
DeepDayze - 02.12.2011, 02:26
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Actually this is going to experimental first, not sid
detaos - 02.12.2011, 03:57
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So far, (as I noted in the experimental forums), I've only managed to crash kwin on shutdown once. Other than that, 4.7.2 has been just as speedy and rock solid as every other good debian release.
qord - 02.12.2011, 12:13
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I only found an issue with my external USB-Soundcard (internal is OK), it stopped working with KDE Apps after the upgrade, non-KDE and CLI were OK...

Only could get it to work with pulseaudio and even then I have to unplug and plug it after reboot... a bit annoying but not a showstopper.
krisbee - 03.12.2011, 10:40
Post subject:
I dont like the sound of that! My desktop hifi uses an external DAC with USB connection and I definitely don't want pusleaudio adding to the software layers. Guess I'll just have to stick to MPD or VLC then.

But I do have a separate XFCE instal configuerd with OSS if I really need it.


HIFI: Bersford 7520DAC modded with gator board, Quad 306 power amp and AVI Neutron 3 speakers.
mylo - 03.12.2011, 11:25
Post subject:
One question: to find out my kde version actually installed do I check

      Code:
apt-cache policy kdm


instead of

      Code:
apt-cache policy kde
?
muchan - 03.12.2011, 11:45
Post subject:
(for example)
apt-cache policy kdebase-runtime
Lat - 04.12.2011, 04:49
Post subject:
or
$ kde4-config -v
belze - 05.12.2011, 14:07
Post subject:
on git repository i saw they are preparing 4.7.4
DeepDayze - 06.12.2011, 02:00
Post subject:
      belze wrote:
on git repository i saw they are preparing 4.7.4


So that might be the actual version coming to Sid as the 4.7.2 packages are in experimental mainly for testing and ironing out any bugs so as to make the upgrade path smoother
arwa - 06.12.2011, 08:29
Post subject:
As kde updates are coming to experimental I would like to upgrade from the experimental-snapshots that I have installed. On one machine the updates from experimental would be installed, on another they won't. The difference between the machines is the configured pinning. If you have the file /etc/apt/preferences with the following content
      Code:

Package: *
Pin: release a=experimental
Pin-Priority: 101

the updates from experimental are installed.

To be honest: I do not understand this pinning. Is this dangerous somehow or can I use it to update to the more recent kde packages? Or will other packages be updated to the experimental version as well? Is there a better way to upgrade only KDE to the experimental version?
DonKult - 06.12.2011, 12:18
Post subject:
      arwa wrote:
      Code:

Package: *
Pin: release a=experimental
Pin-Priority: 101

the updates from experimental are installed.

To be honest: I do not understand this pinning. Is this dangerous somehow or can I use it to update to the more recent kde packages?

It's dangerous in a way that it will automatically install packages from experimental if the last time you installed the package it came from experimental (or another less priority source than unstable). Installing stuff from experimental is dangerous in general, but you might want to "ignore" the danger to taste the latest and greatest. That´s your choice, but keep in mind that the amount of people able to help you decreases anti-proportional with the rise of danger as less people will do it…
(A backup and a fallback display manager doesn't hurt in case something goes horribly wrong…)

      arwa wrote:
Or will other packages be updated to the experimental version as well?

No - as long as Pin-Priority is below 500 (and above 100) as APT installs the version with the highest pin (which is not a downgrade). For details see 'man apt_preferences'. But don't read it while being sleepy: The topic is complex and a wrong setting will setup you up for problems in the long run…


btw: If i remember correctly, the repo from the kde team has ButAutomaticUpgrades-flag set, so if you have your packages from there, upgrades will be done automatically (this flag behaves like setting the Pin-Priority manually).
orinoco - 06.12.2011, 15:05
Post subject:
I moved to 4.7.2 yesterday. But I can't install dragonplayer or kaffeine.

      Code:
root@jake:/etc/apt/sources.list.d# apt-get -t experimental-snapshots install dragonplayer
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree       
Reading state information... Done
Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have
requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable
distribution that some required packages have not yet been created
or been moved out of Incoming.
The following information may help to resolve the situation:

The following packages have unmet dependencies:
 dragonplayer : Depends: libxine1 (>= 1.1.8-1) but it is not going to be installed
                Depends: libxine1-x but it is not going to be installed
E: Broken packages
root@jake:/etc/apt/sources.list.d# apt-get -t experimental-snapshots install kaffeine
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree       
Reading state information... Done
Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have
requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable
distribution that some required packages have not yet been created
or been moved out of Incoming.
The following information may help to resolve the situation:

The following packages have unmet dependencies:
 kaffeine : Depends: libxine1 (>= 1.1.8-1) but it is not going to be installed
            Depends: libxine1-ffmpeg but it is not going to be installed
            Depends: libxine1-x but it is not going to be installed
E: Broken packages


What's wrong with libxine1?
orinoco - 06.12.2011, 15:11
Post subject:
      orinoco wrote:
What's wrong with libxine1?


Wrong xine version. Now it works.
detaos - 07.12.2011, 18:07
Post subject:
From the debian-kde mailing list:

4.7.2 won't be uploaded to sid.
4.7.3 won't be uploaded at all.
4.7.4 will be uploaded to qt-kde.debian.net soon.
arwa - 08.12.2011, 07:31
Post subject:
If 4.7.2 will never be uploaded to sid, why is it uploaded to experimental? Is there an technical advantage of having the packages in experimental instead of experimental-snapshots?
DonKult - 08.12.2011, 17:10
Post subject:
A few more people testing it - and it's build on more architectures (debian is mostly the first "user" complaining about build-failures on arm{el,hf} or mips{,el}, even through (more or less) mainstream hardware exists for those (e.g. your android phones are arm-hardware), this hardware isn't powerful enough to build big stuff like KDE on it - but it can be used on them. And you want to find this buildfailures better now than in the middle of the transition (as KDE takes at least two weeks to build on all architectures; and each buildfailure would reset the counter…).

And the package(names) moved through NEW, so in case 4.7.4 or on of the following versions gets a slot by the release team, an upload to sid directly would be possible (Provided that it doesn't add new package names)
hefee - 09.12.2011, 03:06
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And another advantage is, that you can file and find bugs via bugs.debian.org (aka bts) for these packages.
arwa - 09.12.2011, 08:00
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Thank you for the answers. It is interesting to read about the reasons for experimental packages..
belze - 18.12.2011, 15:37
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according to http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg ... 3b8068ee73 and http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg ... 4a25e59ddb kde 4.7.4 is coming to experimental
We're not going to have a Christmas gift for unstable. Let's see if it become true before the end of the year!
DeepDayze - 18.12.2011, 16:24
Post subject:
With KDE SC 4.8 release on the horizon, I'm sure this could be the release that can hit Sid directly provided that no new or changed package names are encountered as well as major showstopper bugs detected.

It sure has been a really long road in getting 4.7 to debian and likewise with KDE 4.6.
belze - 18.12.2011, 16:54
Post subject:
      DeepDayze wrote:

It sure has been a really long road in getting 4.7 to debian and likewise with KDE 4.6.

True. How can I, a simple enthusiastic user, help debian to make next version faster to come to sid? Do anyone have a tip?
DeepDayze - 18.12.2011, 17:08
Post subject:
      belze wrote:
      DeepDayze wrote:

It sure has been a really long road in getting 4.7 to debian and likewise with KDE 4.6.

True. How can I, a simple enthusiastic user, help debian to make next version faster to come to sid? Do anyone have a tip?


if you aren't a developer type you could help with testing at least
domicius - 18.12.2011, 17:54
Post subject:
      belze wrote:
How can I, a simple enthusiastic user, help debian to make next version faster to come to sid? Do anyone have a tip?

Take a look at http://pkg-kde.alioth.debian.org/join.html
belze - 19.12.2011, 10:34
Post subject:
      DeepDayze wrote:

if you aren't a developer type you could help with testing at least

for testing it would be nice to have packages to test first... and if you ask for packages, than you are disturbing devs.


      domicius wrote:

Take a look at http://pkg-kde.alioth.debian.org/join.html

They ask for bug fixing. I don't have any coding skill.

P.S. it seems that 4.7.4 entered experimental. Downloading right now.

edit: in i386 it wants to remove A LOT OF STUFF! DO NOT UPGRADE if you have experimental kde installed! Don't knmow about amd64.
slam - 19.12.2011, 12:32
Post subject:
      belze wrote:
edit: in i386 it wants to remove A LOT OF STUFF! DO NOT UPGRADE if you have experimental kde installed! Don't knmow about amd64.
Whoever gave you the advice to dist-upgrade against the experimental repo is not your friend. NEVER DO THAT! Instead, simply do
      Code:
apt-get install kde-window-manager -t experimental
in init 3. That way the upgrade runs without problems.
Greetings,
Chris
belze - 19.12.2011, 12:43
Post subject:
slam, i did install kde packages previously, when released by qt-kde devs. It is an automatic task to upgrade them from experimental. I think other users did it too, and I am warning them about the incomplete upgrade status, I am not suggesting anyone to upgrade the system using -t experimental! And this discussion is under "Experimental Forums » User Scripts & Dragons"!
DonKult - 19.12.2011, 12:51
Post subject:
      belze wrote:
      domicius wrote:

Take a look at http://pkg-kde.alioth.debian.org/join.html

They ask for bug fixing. I don't have any coding skill.

Thats a misunderstanding. You don't need to be a coder to fix bugs. Many debian maintainers are non-coders. At least half of fixing a bug is getting it into a state in which a coder can have a look at it. E.g.: Is it reproducible? How? Fixed in newer versions? In fact a user error/question? Already reported upstream? (Forwarded) The pro's call that bug-triage.

Also, there are non-coding bugs: Typo in documentation. Missing documentation. Incomplete translation, …
domicius - 19.12.2011, 13:11
Post subject:
      DonKult wrote:
      belze wrote:
      domicius wrote:

They ask for bug fixing. I don't have any coding skill.

Thats a misunderstanding. You don't need to be a coder to fix bugs. Many debian maintainers are non-coders. At least half of fixing a bug is getting it into a state in which a coder can have a look at it. E.g.: Is it reproducible? How? Fixed in newer versions? In fact a user error/question? Already reported upstream? (Forwarded) The pro's call that bug-triage.

Also, there are non-coding bugs: Typo in documentation. Missing documentation. Incomplete translation, …

What DonKult said, plus that page says:
      Quote:
Meet us on IRC: First, you should join IRC channel #debian-qt-kde on irc.debian.org. This is the place where we meet and work on KDE-related packages in Debian. It is a good starting point: you'll be able to work on what you're interested on, discuss your ideas, fix bugs, etc

I think it's very important to first join the place where they meet and work, get to know them etc. That's where you'll politely ask for help next time if problem arises even while trying to fix non-coding bugs. And that's where you'll find out if there are any other non-coding stuff you can help with.
belze - 19.12.2011, 15:34
Post subject:
thanks for the tips!
belze - 19.12.2011, 16:50
Post subject:
installing shared-desktop-ontologies from experimental solves removal packages during upgrade.
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